What are they hiding in Area 51? Who really killed John F. Kennedy? Was Humpty Dumpty pushed? And most recently; Did George W. Bush's Administration stage 9/11?. Conspiracy Theories abound and have been with us as long as there has been gossip. I guess it proves that we are naturally suspicious of our Government and that's a good thing. But sometimes I think we take it well beyond the realm of reality.The reason I bring this up is because someone gave me a copy of the Second Edition of the....hmmm, what's a good adjective?..... "educational" film "Loose Change". First off, it's amazing that there are legions of people who feel they have to evangelize this film as if it were the bible. For those people; take a moment and realize how similar you are to the people you refer to as "Christian Fanatics". Aren't you both just propagating a "Truth" you feel is critically important for people to know? Just a thought.
Anyway, I thought it would be a good research project into understanding conspiracy theories and the people who follow them. So, pen in hand, I set the disk a spinnin', and began taking notes on the most recent "the government did it" conspiracy theory; That George W. Bush and his pack of shady cohorts, planned and executed the attacks on the World Trade Center, the Pentagon, and even the bringing down of flight 93.
This is the point where I feel I have to make my little disclaimer;
"I don't generally believe in conspiracy theories."
At different points in my life I've worked for the Government on the City, State, and Federal levels. I find Government in general to be disorganized, clumsy, wasteful, and incapable of pulling off most anything effectively. I would point to FEMA, the CIA, Foreign Intelligence, The State Department, and frankly, damn near all government on almost any level as proof. Oddly enough, the people who most ardently believe in Conspiracy Theories agree with me. That seems like a conflict of thought to me, to believe that the Bush Administration is both stupid and incapable at the same time that they're brilliant and capable of preforming the damn near impossible. You know what I think? I believe that Clinton couldn't even get a B.J. without everyone finding out (And there were only two people involved). That Nixon couldn't preform a simple burglary. And that the Bush Administration can't even effectively whisper profanity without getting caught. On occassion, the military can keep somethings under their hat, but usually that's because everyone agrees it's the best thing for the country. Certainly blowing up skyscrapers and killing thousands is not something everyone would agree on.
Now, to go point by point on everything brought up in "Loose Change" would take a huge post. So, here are some sites that do it for me. Loose Change Debunked. Popular Mechanics. Journal of Debunking 9/11. I suggest watching the movie, then reading the debunks and then watching the movie again.
The real truth behind conspiracy theories is simply this; they sell books, they get made into movies, they're relatively easy to produce, and they can generate a ton of money. They can also preform a valuable service to people with political agendas. The Kennedy assassination theories, for example, have made J.F.K. a martyr, who died trying to set things right in a corrupt and prejudice government that would not let him get away with it. I'm sure the Democrats support that on some level. I've even heard that the government likes conspiracy theories on UFO's because it provides cover for sightings of their prototype aircraft. Certainly that would make sense from their standpoint. As for the movie; I found a ton of inconsistancies in "Loose Change". For example; They question why glass wasn't blown out of windows in the Pentagon by the plane's wings, and then, later in the film, they ask why the plane hit the only side of the Pentagon with fortified with high-impact glass. Doesn't that answer the question of why the glass wasn't blown out? I believe if you look at most conspiracy theories there is always an element of truth to them, but usually far more things that just don't make sense. I actually enjoy a few them myself and can be caught watching an "Alien Bodies at Area 51" show on some Sci-Fi channel. But I don't take them seriously. The real truth behind 9/11 is that terrorists attacked us. They tried to bring the Towers down in 1993 and this time they succeeded. Bush used the crisis to further his agenda, that's what politicians do. People made money and people lost money, that's what happens in any situation. You can read more into it if you want to, but I wouldn't recommend it. A good rule of thumb to remember is this; whatever truth you seek, you'll find. Whether it is the real truth or not. H.C.
34 comments:
Hi H.C. :)
I wish to do a little closer examination of the fact's and science involved in the movie.
H.C. said:..."to believe that the Bush Administration is both stupid and incapable at the same time that they're brilliant and capable of preforming the damn near impossible."
Well, hmmmm. The Tuskegee experiments on Black Men lasted from 1932-1972. The Federal Health Dept. promised to give health treatment to them for free to combat their syphillis. Well the Feds didn't give any care at all, they just studied the effects for 40 years. This was covered up for 40 friggin years! Through many presidents and Congresses.
Yes Black Folks, FDR started it and ya still keep voting Democrat instead of Libertarian.
H.C. said: "They question why glass wasn't blown out of windows in the Pentagon by the plane's wings, and then, later in the film, they ask why the plane hit the only side of the Pentagon with fortified with high-impact glass."
I don't think anyone with a straight face will agree with you here. ;)
An impact resistant glass that resists the momentum of an extremely large and heavy wing?!
There wasn't even an indentation of the wings where they (allegedly) hit the concrete either. Reckon they should have made the building out of this super glass and the windows out of the concrete. ;)
What about those (2) 12,000 pound engines? They didn't leave a mark either! Oh, that's right. They desintegrated when they hit that super glass?! ;)
And where's the Aluminum skin and the Titanium rings of the fuselage?
Titanium doesn't melt at 1800 deg.F. and neither does the skin of the fuselage made of 16 gauge 6061-T6 Aluminum. Try it at home on your gas stoves. Aluminum Foil, far less than 16 Ga. thickness, will melt but not disappear into the Aether, either. ;)
There were no bodies!
No blood!
The sun, doesn't even have enough friggin energy to vaporize flesh, blood, and bone instantaneously!
And of course the BBC has tracked down and found MOST of the alleged hijackers alive and well. Hell, they just found another one of them about 8 months ago.
Where are the bodies of Flight - 93?
Flesh ain't allowed in Heaven.
Again with the Aether?
Sorry to bust your chops H.C. but SHEESH! I don't think you gave this much thought at all...
Take care my man. :)
Rod Ryker...
The horrors of government manifested on the minority,
are the warnings of tyranny to the majority.
"At different points in my life I've worked for the Government on the City, State, and Federal levels."
I knew it! Much like Iraq The Model, this blog is a product of the CIA!
Seriously though, conspiracy theories are typically bred out of secrecy. Sometimes contradictions & misinformation as well, but there usually exists an unknown in some form. If I am holding (or not holding) something behind my back, you would create theories as to what it is (or isn't). So I don't fault those who come up w/ conspiracy theories @ all. @ least they're thinking & paying attention (to a degree).
As far as conspiracy theorists making $$$ goes, I'm sure some do. No doubt, people make $$$ off of everything & if they aren't making $$$ off of something today, they will be trying to do so tomorrow. But I'd be hesitant to lump all conspiracy theorists in the "Seeking Out Wealth" category. If I remember correctly, I watched "Loose Change" via a legitimate link on the internet, not even....errr...the way I typically view films via the web. This implies that the films creator(s) were giving it away, although I don't know enough about it or them, so I could very well be wrong.
And of course, what about all of the theories that have turned out to be true? American GIs were in Laos. The U.S. did attempt to assassinate Castro, multiple times even (& who knows who else?). Just how many dictators & faux governments has the U.S. really propped-up (illegally no less)? My god, I really, really, really, want to know the truth, but I'm afraid that tomorrow I'd wish I could go back to not knowing.
In the end, I wasn't a huge fan of the documentary, but it did undeniably raise a few questions that I would love to see answered (debunked or not). With that said, I'd much rather live in a nation full of people thinking, proposing, analyzing & piecing together things, than one where everybody accepts what the government & media project as gospel. Even if every single one of those "thinkers" end up being wrong.
-n
Rod,
I gave you several sites in my post that can refute every one of your claims. I double checked and last I saw they debunk every single thing you mentioned. I'm not going to waste my time listing them. If you won't believe them, why would you believe me? Where I believe your failing in trying to come to your "Truth", is when you develop two separate standards. One for the Government; which is evil and has preformed badly in the past and is therefore guilty of anything it is accused of. And a separate standard of truth for the people who propagate these theories. You assume they have no agendas and would not be motivated to lie or deceive you in the name of politics-I assume they both do it. The issue at hand is whether or not the Bush Administration blew up the Pentagon and the WTC, not what happened 40, 80, or a hundred years ago when Bush wasn't even in office. So I don't even feel that's relevant to this debate. They claimed in the later part of "Loose Change" that the glass in question was high impact and bulletproof as well as 1" thick. It's in the part where they're questioning why the plane hit the only side of the Pentagon that was fortified. I took a look at all the information I had available to me. I went to all the sites I listed as well as watching the movie several times while taking over 12 pages of notes. I felt that the information given to me in "Loose Change" was given to me in an ominous way,(creepy electronic score), lacked any objectivity, was big on questions but short on facts, and contradicted itself in several places. The facts given to me by the Government and MOST of the witnesses and media seemed to support an attack by terrorists not a conspiracy by our Government. Until the C.T.'s can prove their claims beyond a doubt, I have no choice but to presume innocence.I would hate to think I would ever be convicted in anyone's mind not by the facts, but by my inablity to explain every scenario anyone could cook up. To prove a serious charge like the U.S. Government killing 3000+ of it's own people and destroying billions in property, I need serious proof not a lot of questions, and frankly..... it wasn't there for me.
Sorry Nic,
*But now I have to kill you.* (insert James Bond theme music)
For both you and Rod: While it's true the government has done some shady shit in the past, certainly nothing has ever been done that would require so many people to keep their mouth shut about something so heiness. Let's keep it in prespective.
Back at Nic;
I think the money has already been coming in. Ads on their site, millionaire investors, not to mention the prestege of having created something that propagated this well. It worked for Michael Moore didn't it? I remember when Mike handed out free newpapers and now look at him. Certainly there is money to be made.
@Nic and Rod;
Thanks to both of you for your opinions..Mine isn't, and shouldn't, be the only one.
Hi H.C. :)
Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?!
And leave nic alone, I think he's got it here. ;)
Hey nic, let's give this ol' man some fun. :)
Of course you're not gonna walk me thru this because you would argue, and I certainly am and will not 'cause I know what I'm talking about, and your references _DO NOT_ "debunk" what I stated period.
Now this is a friggin' discussion!
:)
Take care my man. :)
Rod Ryker...
'careful what you say, else T.H.C. will send ya away - man. ;)
Rod,
If you're willing, I would be happy to have this 'ol Man debate you on Studio 1714. I already know you will not accept any answer other than corruption and complicity by the Government on 9/11. So let's put it in the court of public opinion. I'm sure Steve and John would be happy to set it up and I think it would be fun and educational for everyone. Be warned, I know who backs these things, which Bush contributors and supporters were killed in the Towers and Pentagon and the contradictions and weak assertions made by the people who propagate these theories. Do your homework my friend, I promise you will need it.
Hi H.C. :)
Either you're high or I'm drunk.
You ((can't)) be serious... Don't ya know who I am?! ;)
I am only a welder, I certainly do not have a chance against your college educated mind. BIG grin
I love it! :)
I accept your challenge. :):):)
I am only interested in discussing my statement's however.
Especially since you dismiss them as if I'm my own fool.
Take care my man. :)
Rod Ryker...
There's a new sheriff in town.
Hey Rod,
I'm looking forward to finally hearing your voice live. I'm glad you took me up on it, I think it'll be one the highest hit segments so far. Best of luck! Who knows, maybe you'll even convince me.
Hey H.C.
I love it. You can scratch the itch. The whole 9/11 terrorist attack is a fake. It would have been done under Clinton but he couldn't keep it in his pants long enough. The government doesn't do this stuff. It is their corporate controllers who decide when to attack and who to elect. The politicians must bow or disappear. I am sure the controllers are not happy when they have to remove some of their own-like the kennedys. Georgie only did what he was suppose to do as will the next group of puppets. We already know that Ghoul-i-ani will be elected as the next super-nazi but watch how fast the others goose step if they are elected. If not there will be another American Tragedy. The Queda will follow you home (raid the frig and use the last of the toilet paper!) Pesky terrorist. Their newest strategy is to mate with the killer bees. Wow! that's scary. It was so much easier when commies were under the bed.
Thanks for the rant.
Captain Nobody.
You know me. I love a good conspiracy theory as much as I love seeing water cascade down the back of Brazilian bombshell under a waterfall. (*Translation: I love conspiracy theories. Sheesh!) All the same, I think it's important to check sources and motives. The minute that a person or group decides to publish a "Tell All" book that be purchased at your local Borders or seen "At a Theatre Near You", I tend to raise an eyebrow. Asking yourself who stands to benefit/lose out most from conspiratorial exposure (aside from the now ostensibly enlightened public. At least that's what they want us to believe) is your best bet in dealing with some of the stuff that makes it to the mainstream.
But ultimately, I think Nic hit it on the head. When you have governments operating under a clandestine shield, the general public tends to question things far more. Interestingly enough, though many sources who reveal secret government sh*t are doing so under a veil of anonymity, most sources are actually looking to benefit themselves. I mean, I'm curious to see Mike Moore's financial statements...
Hey Andre,
A good portion of the blame for conspiracy theories can be thrown right back at the Government. If they hadn't lied so much in the past, maybe they wouldn't be the victim of so much conjecture now. However, just because they lied before doesn't mean they're ALWAYS lying. This is the cause of these theories. People get it in their minds that the Government is always lying and anyone "exposing" the government is always telling the truth. That, to me, requires a great deal of naivity. If someone is going to accuse anyone of a heiness crime, I demand a lot of proof to back it up. C.T.'s seem to be happy with just questions. In other words, "My lack of evidence IS my evidence" They tend also to be dismissive of any evidence presented against their theories. Every source is somehow corrupted, every witness bought off. All this while accepting "Anonymous E-mails" as sources to support their theories. It's that double standard that drives me crazy. As Spock would say, "That's highly illogical."
UHHH...
I didn't read this topic or anything, I just want you to know that I started my own blog.
*runs out*
*runs back in*
Oh yeah, I'll read and respond accordingly in a few.
:)
*runs back out*
hey H.C., i've actually never heard of "loose change," so i'm trying to watch it to better understand your post and the comments here.
question--sometimes i'm able to watch videos ok, but sometimes they stop and go, and stop and go, as this one seems to be doing. is there something i need to adjust under internet options or somewhere else, or do i need to download something to make the videos continuously play without stopping? i didn't see an email address here for you, so this was the only way i could ask for your help. thanx.
Hey Heiress,
I'm guessing you have dial-up (as do I). The problem comes from the inability of your dial-up modem to process enough info in a "streaming" fashion. Solution: get DSL. A lot of people evangelize this movie, I'm sure if you look around, someone will give you a copy. I don't have a burner or I'd send you one myself. I hope my info is accurate, If anyone else wants to chime in, please do.
Hi Joslyn,
I will of course stop by and check out your new digs. Welcome to the wonderful world of blogging! I'll find your site and I'll link mine to it if you don't mind.
@ Nic,
You brought up an interesting point I neglected to address. Is Iraq the Model part of U.S. propaganda? Honestly, I don't know. I don't think so...but we should all be suspicious.
@ HC: You still use dial up? I suppose next you're gonna tell me that you ride to work on a brontosaurus. Sheesh.
At any rate:
"However, just because they lied before doesn't mean they're ALWAYS lying."
I'll always remember the phrase "one lie begets another, which begets another." Essentially, in order to keep one lie in tact you have to keep adding more and more to it. It's always been in the government's interest to lie in order to save face or to protect particular interests. That's their M.O. Sadly though, the other end of the dynamic has conspiracy theorists who twist and manipulate just about any piece of data they get their hands on; only to then ask unanswerable questions to prove their theory's validity.
With every government lie and every cry of conspiracy making it to the bookstore/big screen, I feel like I'm getting one step closer to taking the Blue pill.
By the way, it's common knowledge that Humpty Dumpty wasn't pushed. He slipped when an agent from the Illuminati secretly coated his shell with an undetectable slippery substance in an effort to keep him quiet about their brutal and vicious aspirations of worldwide social and economic dominance.
Don't you ever read the Enquirer?!
H.C., as a matter of fact, i have DSL and i still experience the problem sometimes. is there something i can do to make my "streaming" better? ANYONE? HELLO? HELLO? IS THIS THING ON? CAN ANYONE HEAR ME?
@ Dre,
A little known fact; The ground surrounding Humpty Dumpty's wall was dirt with a normal layer of grass. Since Humpty Dumpty was the size of a man (site; Mother Goose) his shell would have been over an inch thick. Now, I did an experiment by dropping a normal egg onto my lawn to see how far H.D. would have had to fall to crack his shell, The Answer? 12 Times the height of the egg. Or in Humpty Dumpty's case, 6' times 12 or 72 FEET!!! Let's see the government explain that away!! Humpty Dumpty was PUSHED! And pushed HARD. So hard, in fact, that I believe his shell was broken BEFORE he hit the ground. Look for my soon to be released video with even more hard evidence. Written by H.C. with evidential support and graphics by Andre.
Hi Heiress,
Well I'm stumped. Nic, a little help?
@ No, I don't drive a brontosaurus. I drive a 1994 Chevy S-10 pick-up which goes about as fast as a brontosaurus with much more rust and far worse mileage.
"ANYONE? HELLO? HELLO? IS THIS THING ON? CAN ANYONE HEAR ME?"
*Practicing my not hearing Heiress*
@ HC: I neglected to mention that I found uncontroverted scientific evidence proving that the Illuminati's secret X formula was so potent that it could chip away at HD's shell little by little over time. Two weeks before his "accident", he was complaing of a splitting headache. Perhaps we should have taken that literally.
ha ha ha, you guys are so funny. serious too, but funny.
"Hi Heiress,
Well I'm stumped. Nic, a little help?"
Uhmmmmm.....get rid of the DSL maybe?
There's different 'levels' of DSL that you can buy, but the cheapest form (the one that most subscribers buy) is obviously the slowest. And by slowest, I mean roughly ½ as fast as a cable connection. However, this varies depending on how close you live to your telephone switching station, as well as how much bandwidth your neighbors (or those who utilize the same switching station) are currently using. The bottom line is that under the right circumstances, DSL can be good enough (or even better than cable) to stream video, but all too often many DSL subscribers find that those conditions don't come about very often, if ever.
Yada yada yada. That was alot of gEEk talk.
Wow...did this thread ever get off-topic or what?
-n
Hi HeiressChild. :)
I disagree with nic. I use cable and have used ADSL in the past.
Cable works best when (few) people are on. ADSL works best regardless of how many people are on.
If you don't have any of the following, e-mail me:
1. Anti Virus.
2. Anti Spyware.
3. Firewall.
Without all 3, your computer (MAY) slow down. Also, the amount of RAM you have and how many programs you are running in the background and your processor speed play a roll too. Not to mention, when's the last time you defragmented your hard drive?
Take care,
Rod...
Hi H.C. :)
Hi Andre. :)
I see both of you enjoy the same egg. Kewl!
However, There is a story associated with this (illuminating) egg.
I will tell you...
Andre went over to H.C.'s house to watch some sports shows.
H.C. was out of it. He was very sad...
Andre said H.C. what's wrong?!
H.C. replied, whilst hanging his head down, Ryker told me that if you crack open an egg and place it on a plate, then place two cell phones, that have a cellular connection together, both opposing the egg, the egg will fry.
Andre quickly replied well yeah!
H.C. said that's the problem,
Ryker comes in here and spoils our fun with laws and fact's.
Andre replied hmmm, you know H.C., we can prove Ryker wrong by spinning this in our direction. ;)
H.C. said oh, how?
Andre said well, all we have to do is create a controlled singularity and that way the (illuminating) egg cannot fry because of the laws of Einstein's General Relativity in re time dilation.
H.C. said brilliant! :)
Andre said H.C. I'll be right back with my tricycle and you get yours. Also, pull the transmission from your car and I'll do the same.
After H.C. and Andre both affixed their tricycles with their transmissions they started to peddle very hard in a circle around the (illuminating) egg.
Whilst wearing their rubber clown noses, they tried to snatch eachothers off. - Men are indeed babies ladies. ;)
Gears shifted, and they got up to .8 light seconds, then .997 light seconds!
Andre yelled H.C. I can see the singularity forming! But I can't peddel any faster!
H.C. said give it the ol' college try Andre!
They got up to .999 Light seconds and then H.C. screamed! OMG!
Stop Andre! Stop!
Andre stopped peddeling and asked H.C. why he wanted him to.
H.C. replied that he realized that the forming event horizon of the singularity would have drawn them both in.
Andre said` Shewww!
Thank's H.C.!
H.C. replied let's leave (illuminating) eggs alone. ;)
No hard feelings H.C. and Andre. :)
Rod Ryker...
@ Rod: Convoluted anecdotes: A weapon of choice of the Illuminati...
i know i did take the comments a little off-track from the original post (sorry), but i wanted to watch the video to better understand the post. however, nic and rod, you both helped me out.
i have vonage and discovered the bandwidth feature the other day. i changed it to the normal setting, which was a huge mistake. it was probably set on high, which was already giving me some problems. my DSL runs thru the vonage router. now i re-set it to the highest setting, and voila! streaming with no stop-and-go problems. yeaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!
i am learning about the different DSL levels, and FIOS is now the fastest, at least in this area. i just don't want to pay the FIOS $$$, and i figured since it's just me using my computer, the level i have (which is the next highest) will have to do for now.
nic, i do have anti-virus, anti-spyware and firewall. i do a disk clean every nite, spyware clean-up once a week, virus cleanup every nite, & disk frag monthly. i have plenty of RAM left, and i have a good processor speed. can't remember the numbers for the RAM and processor right off the bat, but i think they're pretty good.
i think it was just a thing of changing my bandwidth to the highest setting. EVERYTHING is so much better now; even the downloading.
it may be geek talk, but i understood a lot of it. thanx so much guys for helping me out. see andre, this was a product of my prayers.
now i can watch the video! thank H.C. for helping me and allowing me to use your space.
Hi Heiress,
Your welcome. I keep a staff of some of the most brilliant I.T. people around for just such an emergency.
Hi Andre. :)
ROFLMAO...
Great response.
Rod...
Hey H.C.
Can we get back on topic here? Ok the egg didn't fry but that doesn't mean that big foot doesn't exist. We have all seen the film when he flips off the camera guy.
Anyway I have uncovered another conspiracy. It was Ghouli-ani who attacked the towers. He put command and control in the basement along with an untold amount of gasoline. All he had to do after that was to place the explosives then he waited for his operatives to send in the planes.
As always thanks for the opportunity.
Captain Nobody
Dear Captain,
Gouliani doen't have the time to put something like that together. The poor man's got two ex-wives dogging him in any way they can and another one that he has to try to keep happy. I'm suprised he has time to shit. However, I did see a picture of a cross-dressed man running from the Towers moments before they came down....could it have been? Hmmmmmm.
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